Swim bladder problems, Please Help!!!

[ThunderandLightening]

My blue oranda is having trouble swimming correctly!  He can't just stay on the bottom, whenever he tries, he just bobs back up to the top.  He CAN still swim downward and reach the bottom, but he can't sit there without effort.  When he sleeps at night, he has a sort of 'burrow' hollowed into the roots of one of the anubias plants in the tank that he can sit under and that keeps him from floating back up.  He's still very active and eats well.

He's perfectly balanced, not tilted to one side or anything, and the only time he seems to have trouble remaining right side up is when he is trying to stay on the bottom and stops focusing on it for a second.  When he bobs back up, it disorients him for a few seconds.

I usually alternate feeding flake food, shrimp treats, gel food, and de-shelled peas.  Should I just feed them peas for awhile?

PLEASE HELP, I SERIOUSLY LOVE THIS FISH!!!

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1. Test results for the following:
    Ammonia Level? 0 ppm
    Nitrite Level? 0 ppm
    Nitrate Level (Before and After WC's)?  About 20 ppm before, idk after
    Ph (in tank and out of tap)?  idk the tap pH, but the tank is 6.9-7
    GH and KH?  Don't know.

2. Tank Size?  How long has it been running?  How many gallons?
10 gal.  3 months. 

3. Name and size of your filters?
Aqua-Tech 5-15 gallon and a Whisper 5 gallon

4. How many fish in the tank?  Their size?
2. 
The largest one (the one with the problem) is about 2.5 inches without the tail.
The smallest one is about 1.5 inches without the tail.

5. How often and how much water do you change?
Weekly.  About 2/3.

6. Water additives or conditioners used?
Prime water conditioner.

7. What do you feed your fish?
Flake food (held under the water and dropped to the bottom)
Shrimp treats that you can buy at walmart
Gel food
De-shelled peas

8. Any medications added to the tank?
No

9. Any new fish added to the tank?  When?
No.  Bought them at the same time from the same place.

10. Any new plants added to the tank?
Not since I got the tank.

11. Any unusual behavior from the fish?
      Fish are hanging near the surface and gulping for air and breathing rapidly.
      Fish are scratching themselves against objects in the tank (flashing).
      Fish has visible parasites or attached worms.
      Fish floating upside down.
      Fish has cloudy eyes.
      Fish have white spots.
      Fish is bloated and scales are standing out like a pinecone.
      Fish have black spots on body and/or fins.
      Fish have ulcers, lumps, or brown spots.
      Fungus or white cottony patches on the fish.

12. Well, city or RO water used for WC's?
City

13. Tank/Pond Temperature?
About 75

[ThunderandLightening]

It just occurred to me that I had added a bit of water to their tank last night, as the water level was getting pretty low.  I removed one fish-bowl's worth (yes, that's what I have to use to do any sort of water change at the moment..) and though he is still bobbing up to the top, it seems much easier for him to get to the bottom, and he isn't bobbing up with quite as much force.

I'm still worried though, so any suggestions for what I could do would be great!

[Lolafish]

I have two fish (a fantail and a ranchu) that are very sensitive to lower PH levels.  My well water that I do WC's with is barely 7.0 PH, and these two fish will bob right to the surface if I don't dump a bunch of Baking Soda in during WC's to get that PH buffered back up to 8-ish. 

Try that - it might help.  At least it'll help rule out a problem.

[Lolafish]

Also wanted to mention that yes, lowering the water can help true SBD as it helps the swim bladder compensate.

How long has the floating/bobbing been going on?

[ThunderandLightening]

Well, when I first got him, he would tilt to one side quite a bit.  Then after my tank got cycled, that stopped and I haven't had any problems with it since.  He only occasionally lists to one side late at night.
He was a little floaty about three days ago, then I gave them peas for dinner and the next day he seemed fine.  Then last night I added some new water because the level seemed a bit low, and today after I gave them some shrimp treats around lunch-time I noticed him bobbing.  He's also been flipping over for short periods of time for the past couple of hours, but he may have been doing that all day, idk since I was in class.  When he flips over it seems to be mostly because he got off balance as he floated to the top, and it takes him less than a minute to go right-side-up again.

I fed peas tonight, and I was wondering if I should feed peas for another day, or just fast him?  I've been reading through some older posts, and I'm pretty sure I've been overfeeding them (Once a day from now on!).  I'm running out of gel food, so I'm going to get the stuff to make another batch this weekend, and I'll be sure to put plenty of prune/pea baby food in it.

How much baking soda should I add?  Do I just add a little and keep testing the pH till it's good?


Thanks for replying so quickly, their tank is in my room in the apartment, so I've just been sitting here watching him stress out for the past few hours.     It's really sad how the littler one follows him around.  He almost never chills out at the top, and has been doing so since Othello started bobbing; not gulping air or anything, just swimming near him, then when Othello goes back to the bottom, Snarfel stops hanging out at the top again!

[Lolafish]

Since your tank is small, do a tablespoon and check and see if that's good enough.  I don't even measure anymore...I just dump it in. 

I fast my fish 2-3 times per week, so don't worry that you're fasting too much or too often.  Most people fast 1-2 times per week on a regular feeding schedule.  If you think overfeeding is the problem, be sure to keep an eye on the swimming issue after those fast days and reducing frequency. Let us know how it goes!

[ThunderandLightening]

Well, he got a pea last night and got slightly floaty, but he's been fasted today and doesn't seem to be having any problems.  I'll update when he gets more food after being fasted.  I got prune and pea baby food to make a new batch of gel food this week, so that's going to be what he gets from now on.

Just wondering, does this sound like SBD or just him being a little floaty from eating too much?  I'm really hoping it's the last one, since long-term SBD only gets worse...

[Lolafish]

Just wondering, does this sound like SBD or just him being a little floaty from eating too much?  I'm really hoping it's the last one, since long-term SBD only gets worse...

It could be a sensitivity to certain foods, frequency of meals, low PH, high nitrates or true SBD - you sorta have to go through a process of elimination.  Swim Bladder Disease is usually caused by something that has happened to the fish to hurt the swim bladder, which you only have control over once the fish is in your care.  You never know what they've been exposed to before you bought them.  Other abnormalities are just genetic, which of course there's nothing you can do but make the fish as comfortable as possible while it lives out its life.

[ThunderandLightening]

I bumped up the pH a bit today, and they both seemed to get a LOT more active.  Like, immediately.  Even if that wasn't what was causing him to float, it definitely helped.  The snails even appreciated it and decided to mate three times right after the water change   

Tomorrow I'm going to try some of their new gel food and see how he reacts.

[Lolafish]

How has your fish been feeling lately? 

[ThunderandLightening]

After a few days of getting the new gel food he seems to be doing better.  He'll still get a little floaty a couple hours after eating, but it only lasts a short time and it's not very severe.  Like, you wouldn't notice it unless you were looking for it..  Is that normal for the round-bodied goldfish after eating?

[Lolafish]

Is that normal for the round-bodied goldfish after eating?

If he's getting more than his share.     You can always experiment with your recipe each time to see if one food or another makes him more susceptible.  Otherwise, just try to feed him less if that helps.  Although when they are not the only fish in the tank, that's a little hard to monitor.
I wouldn't worry too much about it unless he can't unflip himself, or stays upsidedown for longer than a half hour after eating.